An Interview With

Caitlin O'Heaney

(Bridget O'Donnell from 'Masques')

Conducted by Peg McNabb for CABB

What are your feelings about how B&B continues to thrive almost 10 years after its debut?

I think it's fabulous. I think it's absolutely wonderful. It really is a tribute to the fans and I really believe that the world needs more people like you. You guys are loyal, and you're courageous - you're standing up and you're saying, "We love this and we believe that it should endure." I think that's just wonderful.

And the good that's being done, that's what I enjoy out of it.

I know. I'm astonished at things like Father's Fanfare, Helper's Network and everything. It's just so many lives that are being touched by the love that is being shown. It's absolutely wonderful.

Tell us about your convention experiences and how you've grown in understanding of who we

are, and if you're kind of used to us now!

I don't know if I’ll ever get used to it because every convention, it seems every convention, though I've only been to two, but both of them have been so different and yet so wonderful. I'd never been to a convention before LA and I was knocked out by the energy and the love and the people that I met. I mean, Ren Woods and I are still absolute best friends and in Virginia, I met Linda (Campanelli) and Linda and I have been virtually inseparable since then and her husband Mitch feels like I'm his new adopted daughter, or whatever..

 Are you going to England?

I'm going to England, I'm really excited about that. That should be a lot of fun. I'm going in March and I am so flattered they asked me. I'm hoping they're going to invite me to Minneapolis -1 don't know whether that's going to come about.

Tell us about your coming to work on the show. How did you hear about it?

Basically, I got a call from my agent who gave me the regular "you gotta audition for the Beauty and the Beast show, at this time at this studio and you should go pick up the material." So, I went and I picked up the script.

What was your opinion of the script?

When I finished reading it, I was in actor's bliss.  I was ecstatic, I was bewildered, and stunned, and confused because I'd never run across, really, any - it's very rare that you run across writing that transcends the medium. I mean, this writing that George Martin did you cannot label it TV...it' s just great writing. I called my agent and I said" God, well, I'm sure they're going to rewrite this and I'm sure they're going to cut everything because this part is the lead in the show basically." And he said, "Well, I don't know, just go in and get it.

 

What about your audition?

I went in on a Friday and I auditioned and they put me on first refusal, which means that if I'm offered another job, I have to go to them and give them the opportunity to offer me this job which I then take, in lieu of the other one. Then Monday they called and offered me the job and I was happy. Tuesday was the costume fitting and Wednesday I started shooting - so I didn't really have time to research and learn the Derry accent, which has always bothered me because I'm a real stickler, I'm a real perfectionist, and I know that I'm not doing a Derry and anybody that's got an ounce of Irish in them, from Ireland, knows that I'm not doing a Derry. So it's kind of laughable when I say I'm from Derry and I'm doing a Dublin. But in America they don't know that!

Do you remember what your audition was? What scene it was?

You know I've often thought about that myself. You know that dress I wore in the play at the LA convention? That's the dress I wore for my audition. So if anybody' s got a film

of that (play), that's the dress that I wore for my audition for Brigit. It's a pink, silk, flowy dress.

What are some of your favorite memories from the show?

There was a day where they did a Pick Up shot in the car with Eric Pierpont, Linda, and the other male actor. It was the final scene of the whole shoot and it was so unexpected, I didn't have make up on. Just my own regular make up. Well, all at once, we just all got hit with a case of the giggles. We couldn't stop laughing. We were out of control school kids that needed to be separated.

What was your favorite scene to shoot?

The balcony scene with Vincent was my favorite.

Tell us what went through your mind when you first saw Vincent?

I thought he was one of the sexiest things I'd ever seen in my life. I thought he was fantastic. I just, and when I heard him speak, THAT is what made my knees shake. (Laughing) And acting with Ron was wonderful. It's very hard to come into a show, you know?

I can imagine. I always thought that acting with such a character as that would bring something out in me that normally wouldn't be there. There just seems to be something about this particular character...

No, no, in fact, your instincts are absolutely correct. That's what acting is all about, is being open to allowing whatever is there, however you are influenced by that other actor, whatever is correct for your character to feel, is allowing that to come out. You have to think, I have to think like Brigit, and respond to Vincent the way Brigit would, but at the same time as an actress, technically, I have to be open to allowing those emotions to come out. But they can't be Caitlin reacting to Ron, it has to be Brigit reacting to Vincent. And yet, then again, there's the other layer which is the actress responding to the actor - very complicated, actually, because as an actress, coming in to an ensemble of actors that have been working together, I have to be able to fit my rhythms to theirs, I can't ask them to fit to mine.

Their rhythms were so established that it probably made your job a little easier finding those rhythms. Or was it? Was it easier coming into a setting that was so established?

It depends on how generous and egoless the actors are that are in a show. Sometimes you run up against a brick wall - lead actors who actually resent you for your talent, they're afraid you're going to outshine them. I've run across that in my own productions, (laughing) productions that I've been the lead in, with other leads.

Would it be safe to assume that you did not find such resentments in your B&B experience?

Oh, yes. You never found that in this show. Both Linda and Ron, and everyone else I worked with, Eric Pierpont, and everyone I worked with was without an ego and was simply there to make the project shine. I had a tremendous time on that show. It was truly the kind of ensemble that you pray for and look for as an actor.

How much leeway were you allowed in the development of the Brigit character?

I was allowed complete leeway. I mean, as an actor, my personal rule is I'm pretty much verbatim with the dialog unless I violently disagree with the way it's been written. Other than that I feel I'm there to serve the writer - one of the reasons I take the part is that I happen to like the way it's written. But in terms of creating the character, there isn't much time in TV to rehearse and so you have to depend upon the talent of the other actors and yourself to basically trust your instincts and to create the characters. I mean, I not only use the script to create my character, but I use how the other characters think of my character to inform me and to inform my choices. And then again, when you get up on your feet, and you're doing it, you have to be open to changes. Suddenly you will be reacting differently than you thought when you first read the script. When you get up on your feet everything changes. The physicality informs your emotions completely differently then when you're sitting there reading.

That's really true. Ron could have a shift of the head, or make a small move, a look in the eye...

Yeah, and I'm going to respond to that. Acting is reacting. That's what we always say. I may have visualized Ron doing it one way and Ron doesn't do it that way so I can't stick to my original choice.

And also if you do three takes, take three may differ completely from take one.

Are you kidding? Absolutely! And not only that, you want to do it three different ways in order to give the director three different choices.

In an informal survey, "Masques" is one of the top five favorites among B&B fans. Aside from the obvious interest in seeing Vincent Above with Catherine, I think it can also be attributed to the strong characterization of the Brigit character. What is your opinion of why this show is so popular?

I'd like to believe that it was the Brigit character. I mean, sure, I'd be flattered to believe that my contribution as Brigit O'Donnell contributes to "Masques" being one of the top 5 most loved shows. But I'd have to say that my hat's off to George Martin. I believe that none of us could have brought to life that show if it wasn't so brilliantly written and whenever anybody says to me, "you're such a wonderful actress", I say "well, you know thank you, I really appreciate that and it warms my heart to hear you say so, but basically, I'm really just getting on the train and riding it." The writing is the train, and I'm just getting on. I'm letting those words fire me up and take my imagination and I'm just going with it. It's a joint effort and I could not, Brigit O'Donnell could not be, could not have been as beautiful, courageous and lovely a character without Linda's interpretation of Catherine, and Ron's interpretation of Vincent. It was an ensemble and we all worked together. And Eric Pierpont too, and the man who played my father. God bless him, right now his name escapes me. But that one scene that we had, that gentleman, that actor he was wonderful.

Tell us about that accent~ Where did that come from. Do you do a number of accents?

 

I can. I can't do them off the top of my head. I'm one of those strange actors who can't really remember snippets of dialog - I mean I have friends who can recite passages but I'm not that way. I have a very good memory, it's funny, I have a great memory for certain things, but I can't , once I'm done with a character, once I'm done with a play, it's inside of me but I can't bring forth speeches. But in terms of the brogue for Brigit, I had done a play at Julliard, called" Juno and the Paycock by Sean O'Casey where I played Mary Boyle, one of my absolute favorite parts of all time, and there was a woman there, an Irish woman who was one of the cleaning ladies for that floor, and Christine Baranski, Christine played Juno and I played Mary, Juno was Mary's mother. I'm sure you recognize Christine from "Cybil" now. So Christine and I would huddle with Nora, her name was Nora, and she would teach us. She taught us basically her brogue which was outside of Dublin. So because I didn't have any time, I just reverted to that dialect for Brigit, which is not a Deny accent whatsoever. And being a perfectionist, it always sticks in my craw whenever I hear myself because I know I'm not doing a Deny.

Well, it fooled me. I remember when I first saw the show thinking, what a wonderful Irish actress they've found.

(Laughing) When I show it to my Irish friends, they laugh at me.

When did you decide this vocation was what you wanted to be?

First, I wanted to be a jockey, a ballerina, and a brain surgeon. I also invented things.

Like what?

Oh, God, I invented a table - a combination dishwasher, table, and oven - oh, and cabinet. It also stored your dishes and I believe the center of the table was the oven and the outside of the table - it would have been a large round table. It would have had to been cut in certain places so that you could put your knees under the table but in the sections that weren't cut in, that would be like a dishwasher, and another section would be where you stored your dishes, but the center of the table somewhere ( remember I drew this when I was about 8 years old) would be the oven and somehow the dishes would automatically rise by pushing different mechanical buttons. The dishes would automatically come up to the table with the food already on them. I have no idea - I was 7 or 8 when I did this! That's one of the things that I used to...and then I invented something else for the toilet...something, I don't know...

Well, we won't go into that.

No, it was a good thing! (Chuckling...) But I wanted to be a jockey and my mom pooh poohed that, and then I wanted to be a ballerina, which is what I ~ wanted to be. I ~ wanted to be a ballerina. I have the talent to be a jockey too, I mean I still ride, and I've been told by my teachers that I could be at the top in dressage (rhymes with massage) which is what I'd like to continue studying. It takes a lot of money to study dressage. And then I wanted to be a brain surgeon because I've always. been completely fascinated by the workings of the body and the way that this has all evolved is that I'm a complete total health food fanatic freak and I read everything about the body that I can possible get my hands on. I'm also very fascinated by herbs and natural healing. I know a little bit about it. I know a little bit like if someone gets sick I can kind of say, "well, take this herb or take that herb, or do this or do that, or that is your liver acting up, or you may have kidney problems." I know a little bit about it.

I can't imagine why your mother would have pooh poohed being a doctor.

Well, I didn't really follow the brain surgeon thing. My heart was actually set on being the ballerina and she didn't want me to go into the arts because it was an unstable gig. She wanted me to be a secretary, which is about as far away from my personality as you could possibly get. Nine to five is not for me.

What does she say about you now?

Well, you know, she's ..it's hard because I've had feast or famine. So when I'm having a feast, everybody is "wow, that's wonderful" and when I'm having a famine, everybody is worried and they say, "well you know, if you'd only taken that secretarial course like I told you years ago, then you wouldn't have to be worried about money right now because you could be a secretary." And I'm like "Mom, I could never be a secretary. I'll go sweep hair in a hair salon" - at least I could have my thoughts to myself while I'm sweeping, but I cannot do that. So she gets very worried ­and she's supportive and she'll send me clippings from newspapers about auditions in Milwaukee or somewhere. But people who aren't in the arts have a hard time understanding why you would ever want to be in the arts because your life, unless you're a movie star, you can't make any plans.

But if it's what your heart is set on, you really don't have a choice.

No, you don't. When I wasn't allowed to take any more ballet, which really broke my heart, because basically my mom said my legs were too long and I really couldn't be a ballerina, which is the most crazy thing in the world because I'm actually totally built for a ballerina. And when I got to Julliard and Edward Villella, who is one of the world's leading premier ballerinas... I always feel odd calling them ballerinas, but I think they are called ballerinas aren't they? Anyway, I remember Edward seeing me in the elevator one day and he thought I was a Balanchine dancer and I was thrilled because we had to take tremendous amount of dance classes at Julliard as part of the drama program. At one point I went to Margot Harley who was the administrator and I begged her to allow me to join the dance department as well as the drama department and they wouldn't allow it. You had either to be a dancer or you had to be an actress and so I chose to remain with my acting. But we shared the same floor as the New York dancers, the New York City Ballet, The George Balanchine dancers.

You must have felt very torn.

I was so torn. I'm still tom. Even to this day I entertain thoughts of going and trying to join Mikhail Baryshnikov' s company, because they take dancers over 35.

If you have acted in both dramatic and comedic roles, which do you prefer and why?

If you have to do one or the other for an extended period of time, I would rather do comedy. Because drama, to do a heavy drama night after night after night is really physically draining on me. So comedy, for an extended run, is definitely my choice.

Up to now, what would you consider your career high?

My first high was working with Katherine Hepburn on Broadway right out of Julliard. That was a major high, in "A Matter of Gravity."

Wasn't that with Christopher Reeve as well?

Yeah, Chris and 1 were in that together. Chris was on stage and 1 was off stage ‘cause I understudied the female lead, the young female lead obviously, and Chris and I were in Julliard together.

That's right. You mentioned that connection last year when trying to get the B&B friendship quilt to him.

Yeah. Which we were never able to get to him. That was such a disappointment, but my heart is with him and my prayers are with him and I just know he will be walking. 1 just know it. He's already got feeling in his left leg. He completely inspires me and he was always a great guy. I've always, always admired him and I've always liked him a lot. Tremendously. We had a good time together in "A Matter of Gravity." I know that if anybody's going to do it, it's going to be him.

Of all the characters you've played, who is the closest to you?

Sarah Stickney White, in "Tales of the Gold Monkey," 1 think; 1 mean, who am I? (Chuckles)

What are the 3 most common things fans have said to you? The most memorable?

1. I'm constantly being asked for Susan Sarandon's autograph, even by New York Times

 reporters!

2. They're always amazed that I'm not a star yet. This is true, because they don't understand    why.
3. The male fans all fell in lust with my character, Miss Farmer, in "Three O'clock High."

My favorite fan anecdote: I was standing in line one afternoon at a bank ATM in Hollywood, in the late 80's, and the person in front of me turned around, took one look at me and gasped and said, "Oh my God, you're Caitlin O'Heaney! And I, of course, being extremely flattered, said, "Boy, that's amazing. People usually recognize me from different shows or plays, but it's rare that they get my name right spot on!" And the person said, "Well, I'm a trivia expert!" To which I politely said "thank you," and felt quite humbled!

In terms of your career, how have the early dreams of a young actor realized or unrealized?

(Big laughter) Many of them have really been realized. I seem to have reached a plateau and I'm waiting for the rest of them to be realized. But the first ones have been realized. 1 managed to go to Julliard. I worked with Katherine Hepburn. I've been applauded by Robert DiNiro. Yes, Robert DiNiro told me what an amazingly wonderful actress I was. I almost did a film with him and then the actor's strike occurred and we couldn't do it. I've been directed by Woody Allen and told by him what a terrific actress I am. I've been directed by Steven Spielberg and told the same.

Oh? Tell me about that.

Well, when I say directed I actually should qualify that. Phil Joaneau directed "Three O'clock High," but Spielberg was the producer behind it even though his name doesn't appear on it. He's the one that had the final casting choice so I should not say I was directed by Spielberg, although I feel like I was because he's the one that decided that they should rewrite the ending of the movie and 8 months after we wrapped the movie, they rewrote the ending and gave it to my character because Spielberg said I was too strong, my character was so strong in the film that everybody was left wondering what happened to Miss Farmer. So eight months after we wrapped they rebuilt the set at Universal studios and brought everybody in from allover the world, and I mean this literally- one girl they had to fly in from Russia where she'd gone on a student trip, and they had to build an $8,000 wig for Casey because he was doing "Biloxi Blues" and had cut all his hair off , just to give me the last scene in the film. Spielberg was there that day. I had met him before because I almost did "Close Encounters of  the Third Kind," but Teri Garr got the role. I worked with Spielberg and Richard Dreyfuss for 2-3 hours at the Sherry Netherlands Hotel in New York and when I finished Spielberg said "you know," - wait, what am I saying? I have been directed by Spielberg because he directed me for three hours at the Sherry Netherlands in all the scenes of "Close Encounters of the Third Kind" and when I finished, he said "you are an absolutely terrific actress, but I can't give you this part as much as I want to give you this part." I said, "why not" and he said, "because you do not look 28 years old with 4 kids." I was 22 at the time. He said, "I've been watching you for 3 hours, directing you for three hours, seeing how I can make this work between you and Richard Dreyfuss". He was directing both of us. We did every scene, we did the movie! And I look very young anyway, I can't justify it. There was just no way, there was no way I'd look 28 with four kids. So the part went to Teri Garr. I realized my dream, let's see, when I was on Broadway with Hepburn, every night I would run to my boyfriend's apartment just in time at 11:00 for "Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman" to come on. I loved that show. I said to Ben, my boyfriend, if! ever do TV, I'm going to be doing it with Norman Lear. Oddly enough, three years later, Ben and I were both out in Hollywood, we were no longer together, but we were friends, and Ben called me up and said "you have got to go in 'Apple Pie'. I have the script." So I went over to Ben's house and read the script and I said, "that's it, I've got to do Anna Marie Hollyhock - Norman Lear is producing it." So I managed to get myself an audition, Norman and I just totally fell in love and I got the part. So my first TV series was with Norman Lear and that was one of my dreams. Norman and I are still friends to this day.

Well, you reached quite a few of your goals then.

Yeah, but I still haven't reached my goal of being an international movie star. (Laughing.) Well, I have other goals to reach, but in order to reach them I must be an international movie star. I'd like to get paid a salary along the lines of something astronomical, so that then I can take that salary and use it to set up a fund for struggling artists. It'll happen. I'm gonna make it happen.

What new projects are you currently involved in?

Well, I actually am involved in something, but I don't want to speak about it. I don't want to put a kibosh on it.

 

Are the X-File rumors true?

It's not a rumor - it's nothing that's really happening. It was just a casual conversation between Howard Gordon and myself. I want that to be made very clear. Howard simply said we are toying, we are playing with the idea of having a love interest for David Duchovny and if we do that, we will bring you in to read for the role. We will consider you. And that's all that is. I spoke to Howard the other day and he didn't mention it.

Well it's buzzing all over the Internet so..

Well, let's somehow get a word in there and get it in perspective. That would be good. I mean we're talking if if if if if if if if if..

 

What would surprise us to find out about you?

Let me think about that one. Well that depends on what your image of me is doesn't it? How about that I consider myself a metaphysicist?

That would be interesting. Tell us what you mean by that.

I mean that I believe in the workings of the universe and I believe that although there is a plan and we all have windows of opportunity and the universe knows where we can go with our lives, we actually do create our own lives by choosing our own windows of opportunity which are constantly going by us and we have our choice of which way to go. I believe that we are constantly surrounded by spirits that guide us and whose sole job is to be there for us.

 

Are all good? No bad spirits?

Absolutely. I believe that there is negative but I believe that the guiding spirits are positive. I believe in life after death. I've experienced life after death. I've experienced it when my dog died he came to me 3 hours after he died and up until that point, I had been a skeptic, and saying, yeah right, and it was almost as if I was being hit over the head and being told there was no such thing as death. I mean he was absolutely real - he was as real and energetic and vital and beautiful as he was in real life. He was as 3 dimensional as he had been in real life - I watched the energy leave him, I watched the energy go out of his eyes when he died and there he was standing in front of me wagging his tail with as much energy and vitality pouring from his eyes as when he was ever "alive".

 

How long was he in front of you like that?

Oh, not long because as soon as I, in my limited human way, went (makes gasping noise), I was frightened, he slowly dissolved, and yet I could feel his energy with me. And that changed my life. I've had metaphysical experiences other than that, when I was a little girl. I've seen my spirit guide, speaking with my spirit guide. That's when it started.

 

Did you recognize it for what it was at the time?

No, no when I was about 5 years old, I don't mind telling you, because there may be others out there who have had these same experiences and there also may be people out there who will go "Whoa, Caitlin O'Heaney is a nutcase" but I don't care. Because it was such a great experience. I woke up one night and there was this form, this shape like a human shape, standing at the foot of my bed and I knew nothing about auras but it was surrounded by this incredible white light that was just gorgeous and yet it didn't light up the room. It silhouetted this form which had a human form but it was smooth, it wasn't like there's the hair, there's the ears, you know what I mean? It was just smooth, head shoulders, and then down. And I was terrified. As soon as I felt terror, he, I say he, I have no idea if he was male or female, he spoke to me in my head I could hear his voice. And he said, do not be afraid, I love you. I am here to guide you and I will be with you always. And I was filled with peace and unconditional love such as I have never felt in my life up to that point. It was incredible. I was so deeply relaxed and joyful and knew that I was in the presence of unconditional love and then everything went black - I guess I went to sleep or something. In the morning, I woke up and ran in to my mother and said Michael came to see me and she said, "who's Michael?" And I said, "My guardian angel." And she said, "No, no you were dreaming." I said, "No you don't seem to understand - I woke up... it was not a dream. I woke up and we talked."

Did he tell you his name was Michael?

No, I had named him.

Did you ever see him again?

Never saw him again, no, but then when I was about, not long after that actually, every year on my birthday until I was about 11, until I reached puberty... well, that's very interesting, that's true,

from that time until puberty, every single year like clockwork on my birthday, I would get violently ill, where they thought I was going to die. I would come down with these raging fevers of 104 out of the blue. They never had an explanation for it. My mother got to where she expected it after a couple of years. On my birthday, boom, oh, by the way, I was pronounced dead when I was born. That's a whole ‘nother story. There's no time of birth on my birth certificate because they told my mother that they thought I was dead at that time, but they put me into something comparable to an iron lung or oxygen tent. My mother said for 9 minutes my heart did not start and I wasn't breathing and they said that I would probably have brain damage. So it really is amazing that I'm okay. But anyway, I used to call them "the            little people that lived under my bed." As far as I was concerned, they were. They were these little people and they only showed up, okay, skeptics would say, I had a high fever I was hallucinating right? But the same hallucination? Like for years on end? Maybe, I don't know. But whenever I would get this ill and the doctor would come in and say, "Oh God, she's got this high fever and we've got to bring the fever down we don't know what's going on..", these little people would appear and there was always this red glow. And they would be EXTREMELY busy in curing me. It was urgent that they cure me, it was vital, they had to. It was like their job. They were all running around the room and I could-hear them speaking but it was like a hum. I figured that they were communicating with each other. I knew that they were not there to harm me, but it was their job to make sure I got through this. They would put their hands over mc, but they wouldn't touch me. Whatever they were doing to me was healing me. They were small, not more than 3 feet tall. I remember specifically one afternoon they showed up and I was lying in bed, it was a beautiful day and there they were running around the room, and I never talked to them. None of them ever really talked to me. It was just that I knew there were supposed to be there. And they were all running around the room, doing what they needed to do, putting their hands over me at certain parts of my body and I could hear my mother coming down the hallway. Just as she got to my door they faded and when she left they came again­; whenever anybody came around they'd fade. It was like I knew they were still there but they just were not letting themselves be seen. It was really bizarre. I mean if I was hallucinating this then, that was like one of the greatest hallucinations, but I've never had them again, after I hit puberty. I've been sick since then, I've had fevers. I called them the little people that lived under my bed, but only to myself. You see, the minute my mother had told me that I had not seen Michael, in that split second I knew that my mother and I were very different and that there would be no way to communicate to her my feelings, that she would not understand. I felt very sad. For many years, I tried to deny that I had ever seen Michael. I really tried. I said, no, no, no, my mother was probably right, I'm going to try to be more like her but I knew inside I was wrong. Then, when I started reading some books, after Yodi died, my dog, and he came back to me to let me know that he was still with me and that indeed, our bodies are but rental space which we occupy for a short amount of time and then our energy is what we are, our souls go on, our consciousness still lives. What I saw him in is called an etheric body; we will appear in the body as the people you knew us as. Since I've done reading on other people's experiences, I was so shocked to find out so many people have had the same experiences that I've had.

I just finished reading a book which I'll throw out there because I think there might be people out there in fandom that might be open and ready for this. It's called "Kryon" and I'm going to start rereading it. For those of you who are interested in why we're here and what's it's all about, go get the book. It was channeled through this man, whose name is Lee Carroll and it's really cool. It says "Lee Carroll is a California business man who, up to now, has neither been an active metaphysician or author. At 48, he now begins what is obviously his real purpose in this life - the translations of Kryon." He was really just this business man who was really not that spiritual. He kept hearing this voice for years that he kept ignoring, not knowing what it was. He tells in here about something happened to him in his life and he sat down at the computer and be began to type what he heard. Out came this book and two others. It's called Kryon - The End Times: New Information for Personal Peace. You take from it what you want and take it or leave it. But it's pretty heady stuff. My girlfriend gave this to me and it makes a lot of sense, it really makes a lot of sense to me. Those experiences that I had, he actually talks about them, about your guides. Exactly what my guide said to me, is in here. Now how does that happen?

Well, why doesn't everybody have them?

Everybody has them.

I've never bad anybody come tell me they loved me like that.

Maybe you weren't ready to see them. Everyone has them. Everyone. Every single person on this planet has them. I guess I was ready. I'd love to see them again but they haven't come back! (Chuckling.) But maybe they will. Well, you wanted to know something about me, I guess this will really surprise people! (Laughing.)

If you could go back and talk to yourself as a 20 year old, what advice would you give her?

Trust your instincts. I had an agent early in my career and I got a role in "Altered States." You'll never see the role that I turned down - they never shot it because Ken Russell was so upset that I turned it down. This is the truth. It sounds kind of pompous but it's true. This agent at the time who was sexually interested in me and actually now, I could bring him up on charges of sexual harassment. At that time, there was nothing to protect us from that. Now, they actually, when you call the Screen Actor's Guild, the first thing they say is "does this have anything to do with sexual harassment, press 1." They didn't have that in the late 70's. So when I was a young actress, there was nothing to protect you. The phrase "sexual harassment" wasn't on anybody's lips. He was married. I had a boyfriend, which I kept pointing out to him. "No, I'm not interested, I'm not interested, I only want you to be my agent."

It got to the point where he was jealous, he got very jealous of my boyfriend and he rang me up one day and he said, "Look, you've got a meeting with Ken Russell for this movie "Altered States" and Bill Hurt is going to be in it." And I said, "Oh, that's great!" Because Bill and I went to Julliard together, that's cool. So when I got over to Warner Bros - lo and behold there was Bill Hurt and we walked into Ken Russell's office together. My agent had said to me, "there's a role there, there's a small role. There s a young woman that he goes to bed with. There's no nudity, there's nothing like that. That's what you're going to be meeting on." And I said, " great." The reason my agent didn't know about this other role is that Ken Russell was just kind of creating it. It wasn't on the Breakdown. It was just something he had in the back of his mind. So I walked into his office with Bill and it was a kind of unusual meeting - it was actually a very magical meeting because it just all happened within minutes. I sat down, and Ken and I started talking and then he threw something out at me. He said, "Look, I've an idea of opening this movie. I know you came in on this other part and that's fine and I'll give you your choice. You can either do that part or you can do this other part, which is of a female Christ figure, complete with a crown of thorns. You'll be completely naked and it will be an acid trip, because you know "altered states." I would like to open the movie with Bill's character being in a state of hallucination and his hallucination is that he is making love to this female Christ figure on the altar." He then said, " I am fascinated by your face and I would like you to play this part." Now, there is no dialog. The other part has dialog.” I was completely captivated by this.

I thought to myself, "My God, this is so cool. Ken Russell, who did The Devils, one of the most brilliant films ever made, to have him do this hallucination -" I completely trusted the man in terms of the nudity. I briefly questioned him on it. And he said, "no, it won't be pornographic, you're not actually going to be having sex, the characters aren't going to actually have sex, it's more of a hallucination so, it's an erotic feeling, so you would have to be nude." I said, "as long as it's handled responsibly, I feel this would really benefit the story and would be quite a provocative and controversial opening and I would love to do it." I mean, I don't need dialog. Why do I need dialog? We shook on it. I had it. The casting director called John, my agent, to say I had the part but John assumed it was the other part.

So when I went to John's office a few days later, I said, " I'm so excited, my first big film, Ken Russell, how cool, I get to open the film" and he said, "what do you mean?" I said, "Well you know, I'm playing this Christ figure" and he said, "What are you talking about?" He got livid and started screaming at me. "I will not allow you to do your first major film nude with no dialog! Absolutely not! NO way." I said, “It's Ken Russell, it's Ken Russell! Jo Beth Williams had one scene in "Kramer vs Kramer", boom! she's a star. I'm opening the film. Everybody will be talking about it. It's controversial, it's provocative. What an image, no one will forget me! It's great for the story!” and long story short, I didn't have the confidence to go with my instincts when he told me that he would no longer work for me. I didn't realize the power that I had, that I could have turned around and gone to another agent in Hollywood and say "look, I've got a Ken Russell film." It was really naive of me. He kept saying, "no, no, no, this is not the way to start your career - you do not start with no dialog and nudity" and in hindsight I see he was just jealous, just being this possessive lover which he was not!

This is a common story I take it? The old "casting couch" is really true?

Oh, I have stories that would put your hair on end. I've been fired from jobs for not sleeping with the lead man, or writer, or producer. You cannot believe.

Is there a way around that?

The way around that is to stand up to him and say screw you, I'm doing the part, or (chuckle) not screw you, I'm doing the part. That would have been the only way, but I didn't have the confidence to do that.

Have you found somebody since whom you trust?

Well, I've found somebody I stood up to. It's amazing the sexual harassment continues in this day and age, hence the message on the Screen Actors Guild phone.

So your actual advice would be, you have more power than you think regarding agents and managers.

Yes. You hire these people to guide you, but you have to do it yourself. You have to follow your instincts and make your own career. A year later, I ran into one of the producers in NYC and he said, " you made a real mistake. You notice it wasn't in the film." He said, "Ken Russell was extremely disappointed that you turned it down." You see, I went back and forth for 2 weeks, I had accepted the part. And the other thing was that they only wanted to pay me scale of $200. "Oh, you can't do it for scale!" and this and that. "You ~ do this you ~ do this." Whether he was jealous or whether he truly believed he was being a good agent... The producer said "you made such a mistake - Ken Russell would have used you over and over again. He was so disappointed that you turned it down. He would have concentrated on your face - the female face with the crown of thorns." Every actor has a story like this. I'm not alone. We all have our regrets. The roles we could have done. Katherine Hepburn told me herself that she turned down "Gone with the Wind." (Laughs)

And reversely, I'm sure you all have a horror story about a movie you did that you think why did I ever do that.

Do I have that? Yeah, I've got one.

What?

I'm not going to say. (Laughs)

When is your birthday?

August 16.

How many brothers and sisters do you have and what is your birth order? What kind of effect do you feel this had on your life, if any?

I have 2 older sisters, I'm the youngest. Well, the effect, I suppose depends on how each family behaves towards the youngest and I guess being the youngest, I've always had to prove that I'm not the baby.

Yeah, I'm the baby too.

Yeah, yeah, do you identify with that?

Completely.

Yeah, it was very hard because I came from an extremely poverty stricken family and so I got all the hand-me-downs.

Were they closer in age than you?

Oh, actually, not at all. My middle sister and I are only 18 months apart and my older sister is 7 years older than I. It was hard because no one really ever gave me credibility because I could never possibly know as much as they did because I was the youngest. So, it was very hard and I still to this day, they still treat me this way. It's been one of my lessons in life, how to learn to be my own person, with or without their approval or support. Especially with my mom, I can still see things that happen, and the things she says to me, I can see she still thinks of me as the baby in the cradle.

What movie have you ever walked out on?

Uck. (Chuckles) Robin Hood! And "Turner." I thought that was an abysmal movie, and "Robin Hood" incenses me as an actress to this day.

The one with Kevin Costner?

I've lost such respect for Kevin Costner. I was so angry with him as an actress because he completely misused the power he had in that movie. His best friend directed it and he admitted later in an interview, and this really enraged me, his arrogance and his cockiness, he said 'No, I didn't even try to work on an English accent.' Well, no kidding! I mean, there was no character there, there was nothing there.

He never stopped being Kevin Costner...

Yeah, it was like "yeah, I know I got the lead in the film and who cares" and he didn't take it  seriously. He walked onto the set in his street clothes and he kept walking. It was so arrogant of him to misuse the power that was given to him by virtue of him being a movie star that to this day, my contempt for him has not decreased in the least. He partially redeemed himself as a producer in Dances With Wolves, but as an actor, no, not for me. Not in my eyes, sorry. I walked out of that movie. Yeah, definitely. "Turner" I walked out of because I thought it was produced and directed badly.

If you could live anywhere that you've visited or lived in the past where would that be and why?

Oh, well I definitely, definitely will be living in Europe at some point. Most likely, I think, it will probably be in Ireland. Holland I've been toying with. I like Holland perhaps because there's no quarantine with the animals and English is spoken there as naturally as they speak Dutch. I have some friends over there too. So, Ireland or Holland without a doubt.

If you could spend one month somewhere that you've never been before, where would that be?

Wow. Well, that would be just about everywhere.  else in the world. Tibet, Germany, Austria, Scotland, parts of Africa, and Switzerland without a doubt.

If I turned on the radio/cassette/CD player in your car, what kind of music would I hear?

Well, (laughing) I don't have a car!

Okay, then in your house!

Well, the first thing you'd hear would be Mozart, Patrick Ball, The Celtic Harp, The music of Turlough O'Carolon, Clannad, Vivaldi, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninoff, Mahler, Sting, you'd hear the Beatles, you'd hear just about every type of music except rap and disco.

In your opinion, what's the best and worst thing on television right now?

Gee, I don't watch that much TV. But, the best for me right now are the shows, "Mad about You"; in terms of pure entertainment, there's "Frasier" and also in terms of great, great fabulous acting, wonderful production and direction, "Frasier", "Mad About You," "Murphy Brown", "Cybil". You know what show I really like? "Touched by An Angel", of course, but I do really like it very much, very much. Della Reese and the Irish woman, I can't think of her name right now, are both just wonderful. I think Dr. Quinn is a wonderful show. And let me not forget the "X-Files". The "X-Files" is definitely at the top of the list as being excellent.

Ok, now the worst...

For me? Sorry, but I don't think we need shows like Rescue 911, I don't think we need shows like Cops.

Reenactment shows?

Well, no, because I like "Unsolved Mysteries" and that has reenactments, because sometimes I think it's fascinating. But 91 I-Rescue, well, I just came in from the freeways - I don't need to turn on 911 when I've been out there dodging the bullet on the freeways in real life. It doesn't make sense to me whatsoever.

What is a favorite review of your work?

I've had several. But one of my favorites was the review of Sarah Stickney White by the TV Guide critic in 1982 who said he loved me. He said he "was in love". It was "Tales of the Gold Monkey ", it was a series for one year.

Wasn't that the one that Roy Dotrice was in?

No. Oh, wait, yes, he guest-starred in that. I was the female lead and it starred Steven Collins,

myself, Roddy McDowell, and Jeff McKay. And the TV Guide critic gave me a RAVE review and at the end of the review, he said, "and I think I'm in love."

That's great. Did you frame that?

No, it's tucked away in a manila envelope at the bottom of a box somewhere.

What was your best subject in school?

Biology and English. Straight A student in those.

Describe your perfect day.

My perfect day. Hmmm. My perfect day would be discovering upon awaking, that nearly 3/4 of the world's population had been sent to a better place. They were no longer on the planet and their lives had joyfully been terminated here and they had peacefully and painlessly been sent somewhere else to live a good life. That war was a concept which was no longer embraced. That people lived by the words of Ghandi, which are "you can tell the quality of a civilization by the way it treats its animals." That we had developed our technology to where it no longer destroyed the water or the air, freeways were no longer needed because what ever vehicles we used did not require freeways, so therefore the earth had been allowed to go back to more or less its natural state, so we had more vegetation, green, trees. Where plants were considered as sacred a life as animals, children, and humans.

Let's see. Where leaders of countries settled their disputes by a chess game. Where we had worked out a type of perhaps social democracy or something like that where we did indeed take care of our own, but without judgment and without attitude and it was believed that everyone should have a good life and a good standard of living so there was no poverty or hunger. We had managed to balance the world and manage the world that there was enough food and the distribution of wealth was equal, because there really is no need for poverty. It's absurd. Where I, in this perfect day, was satisfied knowing that I was a working actress who had realized her dreams of a production company and a permanent fund for struggling artists. And where AIDS and cancer and leukemia, and heart disease had been eliminated. Where there was no need for capital punishment because people that did commit crimes like rape, murder, and child molestation - we had found cures for all diseases because we actually tested on humans instead of other species, and we used the people who committed those crimes -let those people really give something back to society. I don't see any need in killing them. I don't see why it's ok for the government to kill but it's not ok for us to kill. I think that's a double standard. And, I guess, in that perfect day would be somewhere along the line a beautiful home, a husband, a child, all my animals, friends, joy, i.e. peace, prosperity, abundance, success, balance, and a really good meal. Laughter.

What is your favorite meal?

Oh God, my favorite meal. (Laughs) Well, this is probably going to be one of those things that will surprise the readers! My favorite meal would be the most sumptuous ayurvedic macrobiotic feast that you could possibly imagine. There would have to be several different dishes of imaginatively prepared grains and vegetables. Maybe an hors d' oeuvre of samosas, a combination of Indian, macrobiotic and ayurvedic.

I'm not familiar with ayurvedic. What is that?

I don't know exactly its definition, but it's a belief system out of India and it has to do with balancing your self physically and spiritually through your diet, thoughts, and exercise, like yoga. It's a mind body balance. I have a recipe book here. For example, this morning I drank a tea that is ayurvedic. It was cardamom, cinnamon, cloves, ginger, black pepper, goat's milk and honey. I drink goat's milk, not cow's milk because goat's milk is the closest thing on the planet to human breast milk, as opposed to human arm milk. (Laughing.) Your body can identify it and digest it, it's almost like having predigested milk and the calcium is three times higher than in cow's milk.

What does it taste like?

I think it's fabulous, but I know people who absolutely loathe it, they think it tastes like a goat. Well, you know, it's goat milk! It's probably something you have to get used to - I loved it from the start and can't get enough of it as cow's milk makes me ill. There is a school of thought that it's really unhealthy - look at all these lactose intolerant people, I being one of them. The only way I can have cow's milk is in butter, or mozzarella. But you can make mozzarella from goat's milk too. I just believe it's healthier. So anyway, for my favorite meal, I'd have to have some kind of vegetarian Indian, macrobiotic, ayurvedic feast with the most amazing deserts at the end like tofu pies, and puddings, and cookies, all kinds of dairy-free, sweetened only with barley malts, date sugar, or honey.

So I take it you're vegetarian?

Yeah. Occasionally, if circumstances dictate it or my body dictates it, I will have fish, white fish, no shell fish and chicken. But I really prefer if I'm going to have a chicken, to use free range chicken because I have had a couple of hens who have been friends of mine, Eloise and Lucille were hens I lived with. And now my cat has brought home a hen, Hannah, one of my cats best friends. It's hysterical. I got back from Virginia and there is this hen in the back yard. It obviously belongs to someone in the neighborhood, but it has decided it lives here. And it eats cat food! I'm not kidding you! And it sits right next to the cat all day long, they hang out in the back yard all day long and they sit right next to each other. They drink out of the same water bowl, and I felt bad, I was throwing fruit out the window, it didn't like the fruit. I threw brown rice, it kind of liked that. But when I threw out some Purina cat chow out there, Hannah jumped on it. Gorges herself everyday on Purina cat chow. I hate to tell her it's' got chicken in it. Isn't that hysterical? So that's Hannah, the hen.

So you don't eat chicken very often. out of due respect for the hens you've known.

Out of due respect, and health, but mostly out of respect. No red meat, haven't had that in over 20 years.

What would you like your epitaph to read?

Oh God, I'd have to think about that. The first thing that came to me was "please wipe your shoes." (Laughs)

Do you believe there are such things. as soulmates?

Yes, absolutely.

What movie or TV scene, if any, last brought tears to your eyes?

The most recent one was the rerun of "Mad About You", the one where, I don't watch TV very much but I happened to tune in the other night to where Helen Hunt's character had kissed a fellow worker, and they broke up over it. They didn't know what to do and they had this huge scene at the Met in New York and they ended up walking through Central Park. It was just written so well. I've said those words, I've been there - it was just written so well and acted so well... why Paul Reiser didn't get the Emmy is just another instance of idiocy in this town. But thank God Helen Hunt did. So, yeah, that brought tears, more than that, I was like sobbing. It was wonderful. And for movies, the last one was "Sense and Sensibility." Perfect movie.

What TV show or movie are you embarrassed to say you like?

I guess one of my favorite movies of all time is "Lady and the Tramp" but I'm not really embarrassed about it.. I'm sure I could think of something better, but nothing is coming to mind.

What is your very best quality?

I think I'm a good listener.

What is your very worst quality?

I'm not punctual.

If you were getting a tattoo, what would it be and where would you put it?

When I was in Greenpeace, when I was in Holland, I really toyed with getting a dolphin tattooed on my ankle.

Did you chicken out?

No, I just decided that tattoos were something that I just didn't want to do. I mean I was in Holland, we all were aboard ship talking about it, should we all get a tattoo, what would your tattoo be...and I wanted to put it on the inside on my ankle, someplace subtle, but I think I would prefer it to remain a fantasy.

What is your most prized possession and why?

All of my animals - on earth and in heaven.

What book is currently on your nightstand?

Currently on my nightstand, I have Kryon, Sense and Sensibility, a novel by Edna Furber...

Title?

I'm not going to give you the title of that one. That's the project I'm working on so that remains unspoken until it's ready to be spoken of. I have Landscaping for Privacy, I have Patent It Yourself, I have the new Time magazine with Christopher Reeve on the cover, I have the TV Guide with Helen Hunt and Paul Reiser on the cover, I have Herbs to Grow in your Garden, I have the Recycler, I have Variety, I'm telling you I read a lot. I love to read. Oh, I have magazines from the Edgar Cayce Institute when I visited there at the convention. I also have Celtic Myths and Legends and the 1997 Old Farmer's Almanac, Feng Shui, the Chinese Art of' Placement, and the Celts, The Woman's Dictionary of Symbols and Sacred Objects.

Who is your personal hero? Someone who is or was a strong influence on you?

Right now, my personal hero is Chris. (Reeve) He's really an inspiration. But there are women that have really influenced me in my life. When I was younger it was Simone de Beauvoir. She's a French writer and philosopher and she was an amazing thinker. Her, and I don't know, right now in my life, I look at women like Oprah and Emma Thompson. Emma Thompson is one of my new heroes, or heroine. I'm studying "Sense and Sensibility," her diaries are on my bed stand too. Thompson is really blazing a path for actresses in our industry.

She did an amazing job with "Sense and Sensibility."

I'm telling you! I know she did, because I am researching how she adapted the novel to the screen. She did a brilliant job of combining characters and eliminating scenes and eliminating characters and keeping the story moving and it took her six years! She did it between projects and after her husband left her. Really amazing through that heartbreak, she filmed it but then again, she obviously used all that pain for her character. So yeah, she's one of my new heroines, without a doubt, without a doubt.

Who is your favorite performer? (Musician, actor, artist, etc)

Well, you see there're so many. When I think of listening and watching Luciano Pavoratti, he knocks my socks off - then there's Sting who I've always been a fan of his writing and his music. U2 are incredibly musically and poetically. Then I look at Isabelle Adjani, Meryl Streep. Robert DiNiro has always blown me away. My God, you look at the people on tv - the cast of Frazier, the cast of Mad About You, and Christine Baranski, I mean Christine and I went to school together. I've always learned from Christine. I can learn from anybody who inspires me with their talent and their dedication. Laurence Olivier, my God, Vivian Leigh, those are artists I adore. Lana Turner was a fabulous actress.

You like a lot of old movies.

Yes I love old movies.

What is a favorite childhood memory?

One of my favorite childhood memories would be running on the beach with my neighbor's dog, Cheetah. I grew up on the shores of Lake Michigan, I literally grew up across the street from Lake Michigan and I used to be at the beach at 8:00 in the morning in the summer and not come home, except for lunch, until 8 or 9 at night. And at the winter, I'd be there with Cheetah I'd explore the ice caves, which actually was a really dangerous thing to do. I used to go out on the frozen lake with Cheetah.

What is your full name and were you named after someone else? If so who?

My full name, including my confirmation name, because I was brought up Catholic which I no longer practice, is Kathleen Helen Elizabeth Heaney and Helen is after both my grandmothers. My mother's and father's mothers were both named Helen and Kathleen, I think my mother just liked that name. I was either going to be named Eileen or Kathleen and they actually didn't name me for about a month because they didn't think I was going to live. They gave my mother an overdose of anesthesia at birth and it all went into me and I came out purple with no lung or heartbeat. So I wasn't named for the first month and it's really cool because when you look at the translation of Kathleen Helen, Kathleen means "pure" and Helen means "sunlight" and I really like that.

Did you have a nickname growing up?

Katie, which some friends of mine still call me.

If you can remember, what was your favorite' children's story growing up?

I can't think of any.

What was your first job, in any field?

My very first job was baby sitting when I was 8. I baby sat for a couple with two babies and they were very impressed with me because once the baby got into rat poison and I was able to tell the doctor all about it. I earned enough to go to girl scout camp, since my family couldn't afford it. My next real job after that was a nurse aide at an old folks' home. I was 14. My first eye opener was on day one when I looked down the hall and saw this old man with only a shirt on walking down the hall holding what I thought was a beach ball between his legs. I asked one of the nurses, "is this a new game you're teaching the patients?" And she said," now it's unfortunate, but Mr. So and So has elephantiasis of the testicles." Well, my virgin eyes had never seen testicles before so when I actually saw normal testicles I wasn't very impressed! (Much laughter)

Then there's the time I modeled nude for Salvador Dali. I was in New York, already out of Julliard, about 21 or so and I was in a dance class. One of the other dancers and I was talking and she told me she had been walking through Central Park  and a limo pulled up next to her and it was Salvador Dali. He told her how beautiful she was and would she model for him and she said yes. She said that it was unusual modeling in that it wasn't really figure modeling, it was more of covering yourself with paint and then laying and rolling on the canvas making body prints. She said that he was looking for another model and if I was interested to ca11 him at the St. Regis Hotel. So I did, of course, I spoke to him and we made an appointment to meet the following Friday night at the St. Regis. When I got there, he was there with his wife Gala and a group of French men and women. I was wearing a red dress and red heels. I don't know why, I just wanted to look rea11y snazzy! Salvador asked the hotel staff if they would open up one of the empty ballrooms for us and he ordered them to put a circle of chairs on the dance floor but to leave the rest of the room in the dark, to have just a spotlight on the dance floor and not to bother to take the chairs of the remaining tables. So there we were in the huge grand ballroom which was completely dark, except for the spotlight under which we sat in a circle and everyone was speaking French.

Do you speak French?

No! Although now I speak a little bit, but back then, none. What I remember most distinctly is that Gala who sat across from me would not stop glaring at me and one of the French woman would not stop staring seductively at me. Suddenly Salvador looked at me, and he didn't speak very good English, motioned to me to get up and follow him. Gala stiffened and became more rigid with anger and jealousy. I followed him to the elevator, we rode up to the penthouse floor, all without a word between us. Salvador was wearing a black and white striped sport coat with black pants, a white shirt, and a thin string like bow tie. When we got off the elevator, he took my arm and said come as he took me over to a very ornate gold frame mirror in the hallway. He said "look" and pointed in the mirror to the two of us standing next to each other. He pointed to my dress and said "red." Then he pointed to his bow tie and then he said "red." Then he smiled and it seemed to me that he was indicating a spiritual affinity between us. He then led me to one of his studios, a very small hotel room, and when he opened the door 1 saw that it was lined with rolls and rolls of canvases that he was working on and he was storing them it was more like a storage room. In the center of the room was a large round table. In his broken English he told me to remove my dress and my bra, but I could keep my nylons on and my heels on. He was quite professional and very cut and dry and very much a gentleman. The wasn't anything sexual about it. He told me to get up on the table and to turn around once so he could look at my body. I was quite pleased when I heard him say "tres bien, tres bien." He then indicated to me to get off the table and to put my dress back on, which I did. He then took me over to another little table under the light and said, " look," as he pointed to his thumb and he said "you." Then he took his thumb, pressed it against one of the rounds of color on his palette and then he ripped off a piece of canvas and said "you, you", letting me know that this was me, and then he rolled his thumb over the canvas, and said, "this is what you do." I said, "Okay." He said he wanted me to call him Monday to work out the schedule. Friends of mine have since chastised me for not getting him to sign it and give that little piece of canvas to me, but I don't think that way. Then we went back downstairs and rejoined the group of people. The following Monday, I left a message and I didn't receive a call back. When I saw my friend in dance class, she said that Gala was so jealous, that the whole project had been disbanded and that she also was no longer modeling for him.

Have you ever learned to playa musical instrument and if so what?

Oh, yeah. I play the guitar and the clarinet. I used to sit in on my sister's piano lessons but I can't play now, but it is still a dream of mine to be able to play the piano.

Who is your favorite poet?

We11, at the moment, I would obviously have to say Seamus Heaney who just won the Nobel prize and who claims to be a relative of ours. W.H. Auden. And then there's a poet called, gosh, I always do this. His name sounds like Cavaletti, and I just can't think of it. We may have to pass on this one But he wrote a very very favorite poem of mine. Also Lorca is a very favorite poet of mine. Emily Dickinson of course, without a doubt, and Yeats, and William Blake.

You know, in answer to, you just made me think of something, in answer to someone whom I most admire, who has been an influence on me? Karl Jung, who my family claims is a relative also. Supposedly he is my grandmother's first cousin. Her name was Helen Jung. My cousin Maggie swears that on his one trip to America in the 50's, my father's brother lived out here, in Encino that he came and visited them, that she grew up with her father saying yes, that's my mother's cousin, cousin Karl.

What is your favorite flavor of ice cream? Or do you eat that?

Well, I eat something called Rice Dream. (Laughing. )

Uhm, excuse me?

It's Rice Dream made with brown rice and there isn't any dairy in it. Mint Carob Chip. You have to go to health food stores. There is no sugar in it and it's made all from brown rice - it's amazing. Non- dairy. I've had people who are Hagen Daz aficionados who have become addicted to it who are trying to kick dairy and I said, get Rice Dream.

Is it expensive?

No, you can get a quart for around $3.29. Is that expensive? I don't know. I don't buy ice cream.

Is there anything you wish I had asked and would like to comment on now?

My dream birthday cake. (Laughing) Would definitely have to be a carob fudge cake, with no chocolate in it whatsoever, non-dairy, sweetened with barley malt or maple syrup. Using egg replacers and you can make a delicious frosting out of tofu.